Bump Maps

All other topics around Descent and D2X-XL

Moderators: Frustikus, simX, Aus-RED-5

User avatar
Theftbot
Posts: 60
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2007 7:51 pm

Bump Maps

Postby Theftbot » Sat Nov 24, 2007 10:53 pm

Does d2x-xl support bump maps
User avatar
karx11erx
D2X-XL Master
D2X-XL Master
Posts: 8112
Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2007 8:48 pm
Location: Wilferdingen, Germany
Contact:

Postby karx11erx » Sat Nov 24, 2007 10:57 pm

No.

One problem is the excessive number of light sources in Descent 1 and 2. I could however probably work around that.

The bigger problem is that there are no bump maps for D2 textures, and creating them afaik is a major task.

I wish I had them though. Just imagine how D2X-XL rendered levels would look with bump mapping (and hence true per pixel lighting).
Sirius
Posts: 1990
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2007 10:29 pm
Location: Bellevue, WA
Contact:

Postby Sirius » Sun Nov 25, 2007 12:16 am

There may exist algorithms to generate them on the fly, but with the quality of the Descent textures I don't know how well it'd work.
-JoFFa-
Posts: 612
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 2:12 pm

Postby -JoFFa- » Sun Nov 25, 2007 5:34 am

Interesting - how you are going to provide the bump texture? is it going to be some additional texture to the texture of the wall??
User avatar
karx11erx
D2X-XL Master
D2X-XL Master
Posts: 8112
Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2007 8:48 pm
Location: Wilferdingen, Germany
Contact:

Postby karx11erx » Sun Nov 25, 2007 1:35 pm

Where did I say I would create bump maps.
-JoFFa-
Posts: 612
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 2:12 pm

Postby -JoFFa- » Sun Nov 25, 2007 1:43 pm

karx11erx wrote:No.

One problem is the excessive number of light sources in Descent 1 and 2. I could however probably work around that.

The bigger problem is that there are no bump maps for D2 textures, and creating them afaik is a major task.

I wish I had them though. Just imagine how D2X-XL rendered levels would look with bump mapping (and hence true per pixel lighting).



Does that mean that if you would have the bump texture to experiment with - you'd probably try to implement them?
User avatar
karx11erx
D2X-XL Master
D2X-XL Master
Posts: 8112
Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2007 8:48 pm
Location: Wilferdingen, Germany
Contact:

Postby karx11erx » Sun Nov 25, 2007 1:51 pm

Yes.
-JoFFa-
Posts: 612
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 2:12 pm

Postby -JoFFa- » Sun Nov 25, 2007 5:25 pm

I will do it for you then.
User avatar
Theftbot
Posts: 60
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2007 7:51 pm

Postby Theftbot » Mon Nov 26, 2007 8:58 pm

Ill try to make some textures with bumpmaps for you to experiment with-though they might not be original descent textures
TheTome
Posts: 29
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2007 2:29 am

Postby TheTome » Thu Nov 29, 2007 5:58 pm

Tenebrae Quake did something along these lines to the original Quake. It does drastically ramp up the system requirements though, which, given all we're already asking of D2XL could be the breaking point for many peoples systems, especially given the huge number of light sources.

On the other side, it proves it is possible however, as the original Quake also did not have bump mapped textures either.
-JoFFa-
Posts: 612
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 2:12 pm

Postby -JoFFa- » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:12 pm

TheTome wrote:It does drastically ramp up the system requirements though, which, given all we're already asking of D2XL could be the breaking point for many peoples systems, especially given the huge number of light sources.

On the other side, it proves it is possible however, as the original Quake also did not have bump mapped textures either.


Maybe there can be set something like - does light cast shadows or not option. that way - user can control which lights cast shadows and which - dont.
Sirius
Posts: 1990
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2007 10:29 pm
Location: Bellevue, WA
Contact:

Postby Sirius » Thu Nov 29, 2007 9:16 pm

The light source count in Descent 2 is not abnormally high... there may be some way to make this sort of thing more efficient if speed is a problem, but I don't know what standard industry practice is unfortunately.
User avatar
MetalBeast
Posts: 922
Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2007 7:25 pm
Location: Frankfurt/M, Germany
Contact:

Postby MetalBeast » Thu Nov 29, 2007 9:18 pm

Doom3(Q4) engine allows only max. 3 lights per surface.
User avatar
karx11erx
D2X-XL Master
D2X-XL Master
Posts: 8112
Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2007 8:48 pm
Location: Wilferdingen, Germany
Contact:

Postby karx11erx » Thu Nov 29, 2007 9:30 pm

Shadowing is not about light sources per surface, but per scene. If you have 20 visible light sources, you have to render a single scene 20 times for proper stencil shadowing. That just doesn't make sense for D2X-XL.
-JoFFa-
Posts: 612
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 2:12 pm

Postby -JoFFa- » Thu Nov 29, 2007 10:28 pm

ok. imagine that for the old levels - we will not consider this technique. but for the upcoming - i suggest to consider the solvation through the adjastment of the light source settings. If some lights will be adjusted as shadowshooters and others as a well...passive ones - then in every scene - there is allways be the main light which cast shadows and the other - supportive ones. therefore it ll be possible to make any scene in descent and to maintain the proper quantity of lights in the scene - three - the lights which cast shadows.

Return to “General Discussions”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests